page 3

Interview: Starr on Abortion

What were your principal reasons for coming hare?

I am representing the Woman's National Abortion Action Coalition In the States, We have sister organisations in NZ and Australia — one of the main thoughts behind this tour was to emphasise the internalism of the anti-abortion movement. As we won a victory recently in the US, the woman here thought it might be valuable to find out how we did it and how we organised for it.

Wonaac was formed in 1971 at a conference of over 1000 women from throughout the States. We have fought for the repeal of all abortion laws, no forced sterilisation and no restrictions on contraception. We tried to change public opinion by holding teach-ins, debates, street demonstrations; going before legislative hearings and filing court suits. In 1973 the Supreme Court decided that a woman has the right to choose abortion through to the 24th week of pregnancy. There are no restrictions for the first three months at all, and for the second three months there are only qualifications on where the abortion takes place.

Since this legislation was passed there has been a substantial increase in the number of abortions in America. Is it possible that with the legalisation women feel any more pressure on them to have abortions?

Absolutely not. No matter what the laws women have always found ways to end unwanted pregnancies, and if abortion is illegal this forces them into illegal activities. Here in NZ you can face up to seven years If a woman, 14, if a doctor. This is no longer so in the US — women can now decide how many children they want and when they warn them. They can be mothers in the best way possible.

Have you ever found any doctors or nurses who don't wish to be associated with abortions? How do they have to react and adapt?

There definitely is a problem and I personally respect the right of people not to perform abortions because of their religious views. However, hospitals should hire staff who will be prepared to take care of women's needs. Saying that a hospital won't have people willing to perform abortions is like saying that it won't have anyone who believes in giving blood transfusions. Besides, no woman wants to have an abortion done by a doctor who believes that it is murder and doesn't really want to do it. We want to have it done by people who support our rights.

What do you think about the argument that abortion is murder?

I feel that the foetus is a potential human being, but it has never been considered as having full rights and I don't think that we should begin to think of it this way. The people who say abortion is murder and should therefore be outlawed are trying to simplify the matter — they're trying to see everything in black and white, saying that it is wrong under any circumstances. Even if a woman is raped, or has five children and cannot cope with another, or is 45-years-old and has already raised a family, she should not have an abortion. Some even think that if a 12-year-old became pregnant she shouldn't have one. I don't think that it's a cut and dried issue like that. It should be the choice of the woman, that she weighs her life and the potential human being inside her. If we just say that a fertilised egg from the moment of conception is a full human being that should never be tampered with, we're totally overlooking what it does to the woman's life, to her future, to her family.

Are there any statistics of the psychological affects of a woman carrying through an unwanted pregnancy against having it terminated?

I don't have any figures, but I do have the testimony of many women who ring up the talk-shows and say "I felt relief, not trauma". The trauma involved in an abortion is the illegality of it: you know that it is illegal so immediately you are thrown into the criminal world, and have to find someone else to be a criminal with you. Many get so desperate they try to do it themselves — taking scalding hot baths for example and burning themselves in the process. We should not advocate an abortion for a woman that doesn't believe in it, who feels it is murder — it is very good that some clinics have counselling where women can be helped to decide whether it really is the best thing for them.

I totally abhor this theory that women are so neurotic and depressed through the first few months of pregnancy that they can't make the decision for themselves. We're always told that we are so emotional we can't make decisions, that every time we have our period we become useless for a few days. We have to reject those sort of ideas, we're the only ones who can say whether abortion is right or wrong. Our husbands, doctors, or psychiatrists certainly can't — we can get all kinds of input from them and get their ideas on the matter, but the final decision must lie with us.

What about other forms of contraception?

I'm not at all satisfied with the birth control pill, I've heard too many stories from doctors who aren't sure what's going to happen to the millions of us taking it in 20 or 30 years time. The medical profession has to come up with something better but until they do we must still have the right to end unwanted pregnancies.

How complex an operation is abortion?

I have discussed this matter with female doctors in favour of liberalising the abortion laws. They feel that it is quite possible to have early, safe abortions done in outpatient clinics by paramedics, perhaps, but not necessarily under the supervision of doctors. Whether this is possible depends on how the law is changed.

You have tried in the States to help black and poor women. How do you get in touch with these people?

First of all you have to understand that poor people do not have the time to be active in the movement. They are so wrapped up in surviving on a day-to-day level that you're not going to get them out for a meeting every night. You can get their support by being visible on TV, on the radio, in their local newspaper. The activists in the movement remain those with time on their hands — university women or housewives, but lower class women do support us. They support abortion not from any intellectual point of view but from common sense. They know they want the right to limit their own family.

What do you see as the most important tasks facing the abortion movement in NZ?

I think it has to try to get as much publicity as possible to push the abortion issue out from under the carpet into the forefront of NZ politics. One of the things that Wonaac is trying to do in the near future is to organise a national tribunal which would deal with the suffering undergone because of the illegal abortion situation, and illegal nature of under 16 contraception in NZ. This can include testimony from women throughout the country, involving all kinds of women. Also, I was impressed with the response on Radio Windy — people seem to listen to talk-back quite a bit. Use this and try to get into newspapers as much as possible.

I would just like to comment on the situation in NZ. I think there is a real potential here, from the response I've received anyway, to build a powerful movement for a woman's right to choose. I think that it's up to women who believe in a woman's right to choose to take on the anti-abortionists, to expose what they are trying to do, which is to control us, our bodies, our sexuality, and our reproduction. We really have to put our foot down, and demand that the government change these laws. The only way we've been able to do that in any country is to be a visible and really powerful movement for this kind of change.

How much of an answer is abortion?

Wonaac is not a substitute for the women's liberation movement — it is centering on one point, dealing with a woman's right to end an unwanted pregnancy. Abortion is not a complete answer. It doesn't solve the problems of poverty, housing or economic hardship. The women's movement as a whole works on these issues, pushing society towards giving women real choices and real opportunities, challenging the traditional role of women in the nuclear family. Wonaac as a group concentrates on the right to safe and legal abortion. Even if there is total economic equality, even if she lives in the best house, has a good job etc etc, a woman might still choose not to be pregnant. That's the crux of this thing. Do we have the right to make this choice?